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[AntiDogma] Icons

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Member

Damian F

posts 6

11:38 am April 30, 2010

Ok. Five Chinese Elements. Icons to ilustrate and for easy reference. For a game about religious believes and means-to-an-end. (The icons would be Symbols for the religions in the setting, and for mechanical stuff.)

Which one is more understandable?

Which one is more powerful?

Would mixing some of them (for example, using the blue from the fist version instead of the one currently in the second) break the graphical style?

As a side note. I'm not particularly fond of the arrows. Any suggestion about how could I design some that would fit the icons better?

(This is the game's logo.)

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Admin

joshua

posts 217

11:58 am April 30, 2010

Well, to know which one is more understandable, I need to tell you what I think they mean, and then you can tell me what's right and what's wrong.

So, the left one means to me, clockwise from the top, Life, Fire, Also fire, Some sort of bird?, Water. The arrows mean that one element leads to (decays into? Can be made into? Beats, rock-paper-scissors style?) the next one it's pointed at. So, e.g., Life beats Water and Other Fire.

The righthand one means to me, clockwise from the top: Life, Fire, Book, Machine, Water.

As for the logotype, I have a couple of critiques.

  • When you use a larger version of a font with a smaller version, the larger version is proportionately heavier. But you don't usually want that. You want them to look like they're part of the same word. If you have a lighter version, you might use it for the big letters. You can also do Illustrator jiggery to make it work.
  • That font — is it Mason? — is used an awful lot to imply religious/gothy stuff, mostly because of the cruciform t and the temple-like m. Now that I think about it, it was used on the poster for the Kevin Smith movie Dogma. I'm pretty sure there are other RPGs that use it, as well. What other fonts did you (or can you) try?
    Dogma

Joshua A.C. Newman

Member

Damian F

posts 6

12:38 pm April 30, 2010

Post edited 4:38 pm – April 30, 2010 by Damian F
Post edited 4:39 pm – April 30, 2010 by Damian F


Interesting associations.

Since that was a sort of blind test, that did give me a lot of information.

The Elements should read Wood, Fire, Earth, Metal and Water. Water and Fire are easy on both of them. The green one as Life is interesing (it sort of is "life"). Earth is harder (in both cases the attempt was to represent Mountains).

For Metal, the second one is very understandable once you know the element. The first one still proves difficult. (It was supposed to be an abstract sword. Total failure, even while most people I have asked like it for its stylistic look.)

Yes, they are supposed to interact exactly that way. One element leads to another, while at the same time one extinguishes another. Rock-Paper-Scissors style.

Logotype. You are right about the bigger font. I did wanted to stress the “A” and “D”, but it might come as too heavy. I think I will tweak that a little.

The Font is Exocet. Yes, it has been used to death. I know, and I like that. I like the “religious” and archaic associations it has. And I like the familiarity. The game is about special characters challenging the establishment (religious Dogma). That establishment has been in place for centuries, so I want the imagery (and visual aspect) to feel somewhat common, trivial and “corny”.

If I find another font that can communicate those things too (and graphically appeals to me), I could consider redesign the logo.

For now, I think it works for my needs.

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Admin

joshua

posts 217

12:54 pm April 30, 2010

I think you can make that sword just a little less abstract by moving the focus from the "wings" to the blade.

It might be easier to read Earth by making it a ruddy brown, rather than bright yellow. If it makes sense within the paradigm, you could show a globe, or if not, continue the mountain to the bottom of the circle so it's a weighty thing at the bottom.

The Font is Exocet. Yes, it has been used to death. I know, and I like that. I like the “religious” and archaic associations it has.

Well, to my eye, that font (and there are many variations on it) looks less "archaic" and more "mid-1990s". Looking it up, I see that it was created in 1991 and promptly used in Diablo. Other versions (like Mason, which is the variant I'm familar with) come after. So it's about as archaic as Nirvana's Nevermind.

Joshua A.C. Newman

Member

Damian F

posts 6

2:41 pm April 30, 2010

Not "archaic" in a "looks old" way. More like a "pretends to be old". I see what you mean. I still think it's good enough for me, for now. Will keep looking for a better font.

After "playing around" a little and tweeking some stuff, I came upon this third version. I think it might work better.

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Admin

joshua

posts 217

2:49 pm April 30, 2010

Somehow, that mountain still looks booklike to my eye. What happens if it goes all the way to the bottom of the circle?

Do gears make sense to represent metal in this world? If so, that icon works fine, though the gradients and curved "spokes" make it seem more about the motion of the machine than the element to me.

Joshua A.C. Newman

Member

Damian F

posts 6

3:35 pm April 30, 2010

I did not choose the color scheme for the elements. I'm going for the "right selection" by the Chinese Elements theories. That's why Yellow. (Oh, and I finally got what you meant by "looks like a book". Oh, my…)

Metal stands for Practicality, Proactivity and Technology. The setting is more Gaslamp than pseudo-Medieval Fantasy. That's why I rather went with the gear.

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Admin

joshua

posts 217

3:52 pm April 30, 2010

That all makes sense.

Yellow, however, is not so far from brown. Maybe try some diminished yellows?

Joshua A.C. Newman

Member

Damian F

posts 6

4:09 pm April 30, 2010

What do you mean by "diminished yellows"? (Might be the language barrier.)

Some minor changes. Might help with the mountains.

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Admin

joshua

posts 217

5:44 pm April 30, 2010

That mountain is definltely less booklike. Did you try it with the bottom matching the bottom of the circle's curve exactly?

What do you mean by “diminished yellows”? (Might be the language barrier.)

I mean, add black. You might have to add magenta to keep it from getting greenish.

Joshua A.C. Newman

Member

Damian F

posts 6

6:06 pm April 30, 2010

Yeah. I did. Didn't like it. Looked more as "watching a mountain through a round window", and less as a "symbol in a sphere, medal or something, representing a mountain". I like it that it stands out.

Darker and more "brown like". Got it. Thanks.

Damián Fraustro
(Mexico City)

Member

Ben Lehman

posts 3

2:44 pm May 13, 2010

FWIW, if you want to keep the directional components of the five Chinese agents, best to do either:

Water on top, earth in the center, metal on the left, fire on the bottom, wood on the right. (this reflects the directional cosmology)

Or rotate that 180 degrees. (this reflects the directional cosmology but puts south on the top of the page as is traditional in China.)

yrs–

–Ben


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